VN Ren'Py Being a DIK [v0.11.1] [DrPinkCake]

ChipLecsap said:

it would be really nice if you would hold your judgment at least until we can actually see what is this about. and more importantly how it would be played, out. it could work wonderfully or not, but i tend to lean to the first option.

it is easily can be a small little feel good event between the characters, with a slight progress with the girls. Jill, did mention the next week, are gonna be rainy days, so may be the all stuck in the library and play a little fun game, who also worked do to the fact, that all of the girls are in to the MC

or it can be an actually crossroad because of the same reasons . .
either way , it is look awesome, and the potentials are endless. and just chill a little, stop acting like we're some kind of ENDGAME and we stalking the time , far from it.

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I think another thing people kind of overlook when talking about down-the-road conflict is that, especially if you are on a CHICK route where Jill, Maya, Josy etc are all interested, and you pursue all of them, even in Ep 5, all of those characters are rather directly communicating that they know and/or expect the MC will date others. Maya/Josy make it clear they should 'move slow' emotionally, and even if that isn't what actually happens, I think it's doubtful the MC will be penalized for their choices made prior to starting to get signs girls are interested in exclusivity. The MC can even tell Jill they're dating other people, to which she'll be like 'well no shit, we've been on one date'. That Josy/Jill have been placed sharing a class is almost certainly an axis of future decision points (where it would be impossible to believe that the MC could get away with cheating on one with the other).

In fact, I kind of expect it'll be the opposite: I would bet that the MC will face more consequences (or at least sooner consequences) from crossing the streams of girls who prefer a DIK character and girls who prefer a CHICK one. It's not hard to imagine Josy/Maya preferring the MC date a nice girl who is their friend like Jill, compared to finding out that he's been fucking his way through their sorority sisters if they get into the HOTs. With that said, maybe there is more context in the game, because I admit that early on I thought that Sage would be the mirror version of Jill - a character who is very difficult if not impossible to pursue if you're a CHICK character (the way that most relationship gains and Isabella's approval on Jill's path only work if you're neutral or CHICK), but that's only true of the very initial meeting, and you can do the full existing Sage relationship line as a massive CHICK character, and she will still obviously start to catch feelings for the MC just the same way as she does with a DIK character.

Its hard not to imagine that going to stay with Sage and then fucking your way through all the HOT encounters in Ep 4 would not eventually play out poorly with Maya and Josy or that they would somehow not learn about them, though. While Sage keeps those encounters fairly private, there are a lot of misc encounters in those episodes (from Mona/Camila to Melanie/Sarah to Lily and so on), and it's hard time imagine the MC can really fuck basically every member of the HOTs and expect it to remain a secret.

I'm surprised people didn't like the D&G scene, I thought it was really enjoyable and was hoping they'd do more of it.

crabsinthekitchen said:

You do have points about special skills required to manage someone else's work that I agree with. But I don't really see a problem for putting it on your resume. If you don't want to mention you worked on a XXX game you can just say you worked as an independent contractor for a game development studio developing games in Python and then move onto technology details

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Yeah. I am in an area that features a lot of NDAs for contractors, so what you'd need to do is say you worked in the games industry in python but can't talk about it in more than vague generalities due to an NDA, and ask them to give you some specific coding questions.

However, that is simply not nearly as good as being able to show them your actual code, as no on-the-spot coding test or challenge is nearly as informative to a hiring manager as seeing your actual production code, how you comment your code, and all the other things you can see in an actual code review.

flippityflop said:

As far as I know, many people on this forum have previously supported DPC on patreon, or are still supporting him.
Speaking for myself, I already bought Being a DIK on Steam and I'm positive I'll buy Season 2 as soon as it becomes available.
As much as I wish I could support DPC on his patreon as well, that unfortunately is no longer an option for me. I'm a freelance artist and this global scale situation we currently find ourselves in has made my future look a bit uncertain.

A lot of people have a "try before you buy" kind of mentality when it comes to games, especially when it comes to adult games. And for a good reason.
I mean, how many projects are constantly being abandoned without even leaving the alpha stage? It really shouldn't come as a surprise that many people are just wary.

I'm not gonna delve into the "how piracy is sometimes beneficial in the long run" topic. I'm not very well informed when it comes to that subject, but from what I've heard, F95 has been a good source of exposure for DPC and his games.

No, he doesn't owe anyone on this forum any kind of respect or gratitude, it's definitely the other way around and I only hope he knows that.

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I mean, I'm here on the forum so I clearly agree, as I certainly haven't paid for everything I try. Like you, I've contributed in the past and am not right now due to the current economic situation. It's just a reality that creating a really good product - a completed game, with good content and materials - is an enormous task that significantly surpasses what most people could ever do with hobby time and probably exceeds what a single individual can do even with full professional time.

But that's not to say I can't imagine why a creator would tire of this place, where so many forum posts are whining about update speed (from people who aren't paying, as the ones who are can whine directly on Patreon) and being salty about design choices not meeting their exact specific fetish or fantasy content.

Maviarab said:

There's a lot of this 'piracy' word bandied around here. If the game was purely on Steam say for example, the game was pureluy obtained by 'buying' it...then this is a piracy site.

These games are few and far between. If you accept donations, you are giving your game away. It's free, therefore there is no piracy here. There is no legal jargon to agree to either. It's a free product that they accept donations for. If AVN devs have an issue with this, then maybe they should stop accepting 'donations' and make it purely a paywall product with DRM such as Steam. Even if they could give a dollar a month, some people are so obsessed and indoctrinated with Steam, they will still prefer to 'buy' it there.

However they won't, as they know most of their revenue stream (donated) comes from people on sites such as this. It's a double edged sword. Bottom line is, most AVN's are not sold, they are working on them anyway and accept 'donations' from admirers. DPC apparently whines his revenue stream keeps changing (my heart bleeds), well then maybe charge for your product and skip the donations. He won't (none of them will) as they know purely charging for it won't make them enough money (unless they do it purely for the actual fun of it, and that rarely lasts very long).

I do agree on many other points of your post especially no serious programer is ever going to put a porn game on thier CV.

Just my 2cents on this piracy issue.

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Acting Lessons and Being a DIK (Season 1, so Ep1-4) are sold on Steam, you knew that, right?

It's hard to blame someone in a niche industry from also using a path that allows more direct interaction and feedback from their biggest fans, to say nothing of allowing those people to pay more than retail price (eg Patreon). That's exactly why Patreon exists, and the whales are almost certainly where a majority of the income comes from - for someone whose doing this full time, stability of income is a pretty big concern!

I mean, I'm here, and I get the other side - I tried this game without paying, and I'm far more likely to pay now! (it is the best or the 2nd best game in the genre, in my opinion). So he definitely benefits - but he gets that benefit regardless of whether he's active here, and it doesn't come without associated costs. I don't think it's unreasonable to understand why a creator could have mixed feelings about that.

Phynix said:

A dream sequence doesn't contain actual moments and interactions either. Your complaint seems to be that one fantasy setting is being picked over the other.

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Because dream sequences, when done well, can actually give an insight into a character's thoughts, particularly their subconscious thoughts and feelings about certain characters and/or events. A perfect example of this would be in the game Light Of My Life where not only does the MC have some dream sequences, but so too do the 2 main LIs and they're very good at showing how the characters are dealing with their feelings, particularly those related to a tragic event that acts as a catalyst for the events of the story.

The MC has gone through a lot in the short time they've been at college, so seeing their subconscious craft a scenario set in the DnG world to see how their mind is sorting through all the chaos and relationship drama would be, for me, far more insightful than seeing LIs get irrationally jealous, suspicious, or possibly even angry over a fantasy RPG.

Holy Bacchus said:

Because dream sequences, when done well, can actually give an insight into a character's thoughts, particularly their subconscious thoughts and feelings about certain characters and/or events. A perfect example of this would be in the game Light Of My Life where not only does the MC have some dream sequences, but so too do the 2 main LIs and they're very good at showing how the characters are dealing with their feelings, particularly those related to a tragic event that acts as a catalyst for the events of the story.

The MC has gone through a lot in the short time they've been at college, so seeing their subconscious craft a scenario set in the DnG world to see how their mind is sorting through all the chaos and relationship drama would be, for me, far more insightful than seeing LIs get irrationally jealous, suspicious, or possibly even angry over a fantasy RPG.

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The game already has had some dream sequences (mostly erotic), but given the MC doesn't play that game regularly (or ever, except in that one very brief scene), it doesn't make a ton of sense as a vehicle for their thoughts. You could certainly use dream sequences (even erotic render dream sequences) to convey the character's worries and thoughts. However, I think most of the ways you might think of as ways to do that might make folks upset or start to involve content that not everyone wants in their games. For example, it would make a lot of sense for the MC to be worried about Quinn taking advantage of Maya and pressuring her or duping her into the restaurant scheme, but a lot of people would be upset if the protagonist had a NTR Maya dream worrying about it, because they don't want NTR content in their game. DPC threw a small bone in this direction in some of the rewards renders (there's the Mixed render series that is a series of Maya x Quinn with a strapon scenes), but those are much easier to avoid if you don't like that kind of content than something directly in the game.

NTR content, or at least well-done NTR content, doesn't bother or offend me, but that so many creators feel obligated to put switches and options in their game to disable or conceal NTR content from those who don't want it is a pretty strong indicator that they feel like it would turn users off of their creation.

xsssssssss said:

Is it just me or does Sage's nreast look odd in tha pic?

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Yeah, it's not out in the sunshine

Maviarab said:

I've never drunk beer with a sister I don't have in the back of an RV I've never driven...hasn't stopped my dreaming about it once.

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I mean, sure, people dream about things that have never happened all the time, but they frequently do so within the bounds of their experiences - it's why, for example, weird high school dreams are so common. And you have the experiences of drinking beer and being in an RV for your subconscious to work through, whereas someone like the MC probably has almost none of the details of that kind of setting that you'd need to have a detailed dream about it.

Holy Bacchus said:

Because dream sequences, when done well, can actually give an insight into a character's thoughts, particularly their subconscious thoughts and feelings about certain characters and/or events. A perfect example of this would be in the game Light Of My Life where not only does the MC have some dream sequences, but so too do the 2 main LIs and they're very good at showing how the characters are dealing with their feelings, particularly those related to a tragic event that acts as a catalyst for the events of the story.

The MC has gone through a lot in the short time they've been at college, so seeing their subconscious craft a scenario set in the DnG world to see how their mind is sorting through all the chaos and relationship drama would be, for me, far more insightful than seeing LIs get irrationally jealous, suspicious, or possibly even angry over a fantasy RPG.

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And why would there be any drama at all, you said it yourself, first game didn't have any impact. But i suppose with so many LI's together there might be some consequences this time. Personally i would like it if we get the chance to mess around a bit. For example being with M&J, but in game favoring Sage over them leading to some weird looks, perhaps a bit of dialogue during and after the game, but not any lasting effects.

zoyle said:

I mean, sure, people dream about things that have never happened all the time, but they frequently do so within the bounds of their experiences - it's why, for example, weird high school dreams are so common. And you have the experiences of drinking beer and being in an RV for your subconscious to work through, whereas someone like the MC probably has almost none of the details of that kind of setting that you'd need to have a detailed dream about it.

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He already imagined it when playing the game in ep 3. Seems like his subsonscious could easily craft it in a dream too.

Holy Bacchus said:

Because dream sequences, when done well, can actually give an insight into a character's thoughts, particularly their subconscious thoughts and feelings about certain characters and/or events. A perfect example of this would be in the game Light Of My Life where not only does the MC have some dream sequences, but so too do the 2 main LIs and they're very good at showing how the characters are dealing with their feelings, particularly those related to a tragic event that acts as a catalyst for the events of the story.

The MC has gone through a lot in the short time they've been at college, so seeing their subconscious craft a scenario set in the DnG world to see how their mind is sorting through all the chaos and relationship drama would be, for me, far more insightful than seeing LIs get irrationally jealous, suspicious, or possibly even angry over a fantasy RPG.

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your hypothesis scares me, but it also teases me, which would probably end up creating even more a rift between the player and MC.

already now many players feel that they do not "control" MC in the important choices (myself included), with a dream MC would either "tell" the player what he really wants to do, or "ask" the player what to do (who to choose, who to dump.. .).

the first hypothesis would be the most probable (the second would imply that at that point the game must be divided on different branches), at which point we (players) should accept what the dream suggests to us?

felicemastronzo said:

your hypothesis scares me, but it also teases me, which would probably end up creating even more a rift between the player and MC.

already now many players feel that they do not "control" MC in the important choices (myself included), with a dream MC would either "tell" the player what he really wants to do, or "ask" the player what to do (who to choose, who to dump.. .).

the first hypothesis would be the most probable (the second would imply that at that point the game must be divided on different branches), at which point we (players) should accept what the dream suggests to us?

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I mean its always nice when people playing a game feel agency and in control of the path and the choices feel meaningful, but equally its beyond the scope of the creations we get to both have protagonists who are completely under the control of the player and who are well-characterized with good storylines. You're always going to be making choices within a certain band of behaviors and personality. You can give great detail and context to those differences (and the outcomes can be fairly substantially different), but this isn't an open-world sandbox game where you can do whatever you want, and games that do give you enormous freedom over what you do and how you interact tend to have much, much worse storylines and tend to be 'event repetition' games like Cure My Addiction or The Tyrant.

DPC makes really good, complex, realistic characters. The protagonist, while you control them to an extent, is one of those. Even if you, say, go full DIK, he's still a pretty kind and sensitive person in private to Maya. Even if he goes full CHICK, he's still willing/capable of all sorts of fratty stuff. He's a range of possibilities. Hopefully folks who play the game can find where that range overlaps with theirs, but it's never gonna be perfect, and it's not gonna be realistic to support the full range of personalities. And that is necessary, I think: In order for the interactable characters to be well-designed and realistic and complex, they have to have a MC foil who is as well.

I would use as illustration that even the biggest budget, mass-market open-world games tend to have fairly simple supporting storyline characters. Look at, say, Fallout 4 for instance. You can do whatever you want, but the companions are pretty simple and narrow characters. On the other hand, with Witcher 3 you have a scenario more like you see in this game: Geralt is a person independent of the player, your options are limited to within the range of things Geralt would possibly do, and consequently Geralt gets to interact and have relationships with much more complex and detailed characters. If Geralt's personality was as free-form and flexible as the Fallout protagonist, you couldn't have those kinds of supporting NPCs. They play off each other.

Maviarab said:

And they frequently don't. How many men have dreams of having a harem. Being an action hereo etc etc? Think most have had them? You need to actually understand how dreams work and don't. They are combination of our experiences (the MC has experienced the game), our desires, fears, ambitions and lot of other things. Now while one can actually influence to a point our dreams before falling asleep, what happens within them is totally out of our control. And often, when you can remember them (and there are tricks for that too btw) they are often highly random. So the MC could be walking through a forest in his dream, for no reason at all then all of a sudden he is with his ftriends. That's how dreams work. It's our minds and subconcious dealing with our thoughts, emotions and what I mentioned before and sorting them.

So, it really is not beyond the realms of possibility that he could dream of a DnG game as a way of his subconcious sorting through his feelings and emotions.

To me I'm with HB, it's far more 'logical' then every LI of his being in the library all at the same time and all deciding to play the game. That to me just doesn't add up, unless DPC wants to purposefully cause conflict between them and start the branching/forcing LI paths so early. Who knows?

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I guess I kind of wonder about option C: It's part of a reward render sequence or something else that is immaterial to the actual game, but is in the game.

Maviarab said:

This exactly. There's been many an argument here about it. we do not have control. We are on rails (whether anyone wwants to accept that or not), we are playing a set defined path and character. It is the illusion of choice.

As you say, even AAA devs (take Mass Effect as an example) has a set ending, a set path and all other choices are just fairly monir ultimately. Regarldess of choices, the MC will do certain things, we will end up at the same place (final endings aside). No one, not even major AAA multi million budget game companies have the money/time/resources to make what would effectively become 25 completely different stories without railing you along a certain path as you said.

I completely agree and it causes issues at times (such as my hatred of the 'leaving Maya's dorm scene). Regardless of what you do, it happens.



Well either way, we'll find out soon enough (or not soon enough for some folk lol). Then all these discussions will start again with something else

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Yeah indeed. I have personal experience in a poly relationship, so I probably wouldn't do what MC did at the end of Ep 4!

But a lot of people would, and it's necessary for storyline development. And MC is 18 years old. Even when my poly relationship was starting, and I was in college, I was substantially older and more experienced than he is. Who knows what I would have done at 18? It might have been equally, or more, stupid.


Being on rails is the price you pay for good characters. Mass Effect is my favorite video game series of all time, and Shepard has one of the widest ranges of personality of any controllable protagonist in a game with great characters - but it's one of the greatest game series of all time for a reason, and it was a AAA production from one of the greatest game studios in history, for the explicit purpose of creating exactly that effect, and people were STILL unhappy with the way the story resolved to the point they had to add a fan service patch to the ending! (and, if we're being honest, the two personality paths aren't equal experiences, especially in the first game, where renegade Shepard is often too much of a cartoon villain; paragon Shepard is a much better play experience, where a lot of the decisions feel more weighty and difficult, whereas the renegade options are often just 'be an asshole').

Endless said:

View attachment 765603

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Episode 6 - Preview #5: Isabella & Sage

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didn't see that coming

Bella: So you're saying that you fucked someone on Tybalt's bed?
Sage: Yup
B: Come here my soul sister (hugging). Btw who?
S: Nothing serious, just some guitar obsessed freshy
B:

zoyle said:

Yeah indeed. I have personal experience in a poly relationship, so I probably wouldn't do what MC did at the end of Ep 4!

But a lot of people would, and it's necessary for storyline development. And MC is 18 years old. Even when my poly relationship was starting, and I was in college, I was substantially older and more experienced than he is. Who knows what I would have done at 18? It might have been equally, or more, stupid.


Being on rails is the price you pay for good characters. Mass Effect is my favorite video game series of all time, and Shepard has one of the widest ranges of personality of any controllable protagonist in a game with great characters - but it's one of the greatest game series of all time for a reason, and it was a AAA production from one of the greatest game studios in history, for the explicit purpose of creating exactly that effect, and people were STILL unhappy with the way the story resolved to the point they had to add a fan service patch to the ending! (and, if we're being honest, the two personality paths aren't equal experiences, especially in the first game, where renegade Shepard is often too much of a cartoon villain; paragon Shepard is a much better play experience, where a lot of the decisions feel more weighty and difficult, whereas the renegade options are often just 'be an asshole').

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Maviarab said:

Exactly so ultimately this will be no different. Yes it's great for flavour on different runs but is still ultimately fluff as we are being led somewhere. Also, just like in ME, DPC will have a 'default/canon' playthrough in his head, that is already (to me at least) becoming evident with the way a lot of the characters act and the dialogue between them.

But, having said that, that's just something you have to roll with if you want to play/enjoy the game.

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The problem with this comparison is that we knew where we were "going" in ME. Save the universe, destroy the reapers was the end game. We have no clue where we are going in BaDik. What's the end game? We need an objective to get to and DPC while he has created a cast of semi well defined characters hasn't really given us enough info to know what the goal is. Find a LI? Be happy? Graduate (probably not)?

zoyle said:

I mean its always nice when people playing a game feel agency and in control of the path and the choices feel meaningful, but equally its beyond the scope of the creations we get to both have protagonists who are completely under the control of the player and who are well-characterized with good storylines. You're always going to be making choices within a certain band of behaviors and personality. You can give great detail and context to those differences (and the outcomes can be fairly substantially different), but this isn't an open-world sandbox game where you can do whatever you want, and games that do give you enormous freedom over what you do and how you interact tend to have much, much worse storylines and tend to be 'event repetition' games like Cure My Addiction or The Tyrant.

DPC makes really good, complex, realistic characters. The protagonist, while you control them to an extent, is one of those. Even if you, say, go full DIK, he's still a pretty kind and sensitive person in private to Maya. Even if he goes full CHICK, he's still willing/capable of all sorts of fratty stuff. He's a range of possibilities. Hopefully folks who play the game can find where that range overlaps with theirs, but it's never gonna be perfect, and it's not gonna be realistic to support the full range of personalities. And that is necessary, I think: In order for the interactable characters to be well-designed and realistic and complex, they have to have a MC foil who is as well.

I would use as illustration that even the biggest budget, mass-market open-world games tend to have fairly simple supporting storyline characters. Look at, say, Fallout 4 for instance. You can do whatever you want, but the companions are pretty simple and narrow characters. On the other hand, with Witcher 3 you have a scenario more like you see in this game: Geralt is a person independent of the player, your options are limited to within the range of things Geralt would possibly do, and consequently Geralt gets to interact and have relationships with much more complex and detailed characters. If Geralt's personality was as free-form and flexible as the Fallout protagonist, you couldn't have those kinds of supporting NPCs. They play off each other.

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I agree with you on the general line.

but in a game where MC has to manage / choose between different LIs, whenever this possibility is denied it is not easy to digest.

you are faced with guilt or drama over choices you would not have made and you have tried to avoid by making choices that are basically ignored

and this remains a problem in the gaming experience

then all the compliments you do to DPC I share them, but this "control" problem I think is the main criticism he faced with AL (the inevitable love story with Megan) and it doesn't seem to have changed much

Endless said:

View attachment 765603

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Episode 6 - Preview #5: Isabella & Sage

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Sigh.. why?? WHY are you making it so hard for me to choose!!!!

Yuno Gasai said:

didn't see that coming

Bella: So you're saying that you fucked someone on Tybalt's bed?
Sage: Yup
B: Come here my soul sister (hugging). Btw who?
S: Nothing serious, just some guitar obsessed freshy
B:

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B: Hm... for the last 2 weeks there's only one guitar hugging freshy that I'm aware of.

AvatarStormBringer said:

Sigh.. why?? WHY are you making it so hard for me to choose!!!!

B: Hm... for the last 2 weeks there's only one guitar hugging freshy that I'm aware of.

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*Bella remembers she must get her Axe back from being sharpened on Sat morning*